March Against the Desecration of Idols of Great Telugus
Dear All,
Please join us tomorrow (Sunday the 13th) at 10:30 AM near the Ambedkar statue. This is your opportunity to protest against the desecration of the great Telugu idols. We will march from Ambedkar statue to tank bund. You will also get to meet the Visalandhra Mahasabha team. Our organization is much bigger than the few that have been identified in the note. Join hands with us and stand up for what you believe in.
Looking forward to a strong showing tomorrow.
Save Andhra Pradesh!
Nalamotu Chakravarthy
http://www.myteluguroots.com
http://www.facebook.com/people/@/226703252445
http://twitter.com/nalamotu
http://www.amazon.com/My-Telugu-Roots-Telangana-Bhasmasura/dp/0984238603/
I dont understand the necessity to keep this chapter secret . They stated the obvious.
The forces that are behind movement and issues and the consquences arent a super secret. We have debated these very issue in this forum and I am sure GOI is aware of all the contents in chapter 8 even w/o the inputs of the SKC.
Disgraceful. Outrageous.. I am extremely angered by the contents and its intended objectives.. I am now ready to be convinced that Duggal and team gave into the lobbying…
What is there so disgraceful or outrageous….naxailism,communism & less investements is what they predected for T region and no security for other region people. Its time now to push and kill this T demand for good.
If this is your wisdom…my friend you have to learn a lot from world history not just our region/state/country.
Don't preach to choir. The final recommendation of the SKC is – UNITED ANDHRA PRADESH.
We do know world history
The only campaing that reached its zenith by blaming every problem on their fellow citizens and painting them as the root cause of every evil in the world came crashing down when the world woke up to the horrow
Remember FASICM ??
What is the reason to cling onto power over people that want to rule themselves? Blaming fellow citizens and this non-sense is what I call a self sympathizing speak for external audience. As I said many times this separate govt/administration is to make it a win-win for both regions.
I dont think I need to learn the meaning of selfsympathy from you. I am not the one crying about discrimination or injustice caz of my fellow citizens. The foundation of this movement itself is lies born out off self sympathy
U have never answered the logical questions posed by folks in this forum and meander into some sort of rhetoric
U failed to understand that this moment is not just for administrative convenience
The real disgrace is ..the judge while passing the judgement that it should be released in two weeks..himslef relesed it. Why?
Does he alredy know that the Apex court will not allow it to be released. As a learned judge doesn't he know he is denying the oppertunity to the center to pursue the case in SC. Why he leaked it already to the press?
He again mentions 600 deaths, 20 cr. expenditure, telangana movement again and again when the context o the arguement is only about whether to release chapter 8 or not?. His intentions are crystal clear .
I am eagerly waiting how the english press, Central govt and may be SC itseld respond to such behaviour by the judge. And this was not the first time he passed remarks on SKC like this.
I guess timesofindia responded already.
Did it endorse, I mean supported Judge's views and his actions ot revealing the supposed 'secrets'?
GK, what is disgraceful? threatening the andhra ppl or someone publishing it?
then what you might consider about these..
1) ఆంధ్ర విద్యాసంస్థలను మూసివేస్తాం…. (తోక, అక్రమాలు చేసే)
2) సీమాంధ్ర మీడియా ని తెలంగాణ లో నిషేదించాలి. ( ఉద్యమాన్ని మనకు నచ్చిన విధంగా చూపనందుకు)
3) హోటళ్ళపై ఆంధ్ర భోజనం అని వుంటే దాడులు
4) బ్యాంకు పై ఆంధ్ర అని ఉంటే దాడి
5) పరీక్ష పత్రాలని దిద్దటానికి వచ్చినా కూడా వెంటబడి తరిమి దాడులు
5) వాహనాల రిజిస్ట్రేషన్ నంబర్ చూసి మరీ దాడులు
6) సినిమా షూటింగ్ లపై దాడులు
7) ఇవి కాక ఉద్యమం పేరు తో తెర వెనుక వసూళ్ళు
VIII) చేసే అరాచకాలని బయటపెట్టే వాళ్ళపై దాడులు
9) సీమాంధ్ర పెట్టుబడిదారుల్ని తరిమేస్తాం. (తోక.. తెలంగాణ ని దోచుకున్న)
10) మెదక్ లో BSNL ఉద్యోగుల ఇళ్ళపై ఖాళీ చేసి వెళ్ళాలనే బెదిరింపు లేఖలు
11) కూకట్పల్లి లో సమైక్యాంధ్ర ర్యాలీ నిర్వహిస్తే దాడులు.
The report revealed such things only. So, pl calm down from ur rage. May be sitting in a remote corner of the world, you may be reading the glorifying articles of the movement. But the movement is… a collection of lies, some ppl’s selfish agenda and hatred on the other regions injected into ppl’s mind in the name of sentiment & movement- A tiring effort to keep that venom alive and make the ppl’s rationale die.
Satya,
I don't want to respond to your points on incidents rather than on the core subject. You need to put yourself in the other person's shoes and see what their aspirations are. Please apply common sense and think when the entire cross-section of the region is expressing their anguish and you are happy with it, do you think it will fly as a solution?
The core of the issue was T region was dicriminated which was a lie as proved by SKC. So what is there to put someone in your shoes and see. Shame on the political parties from T region which tried to stir up the emoitions of people for the division of the state.
I don't know how much ur contribution is for the core subject of this moment which is discrimination. Slowly after discrimination plank is not worked, they moved it to self respect.. After that too failed now, u guys may be talking about 'leaving space to others'. God knows what does that mean? if we are taking anything unethically, or illegally u can tell leave etc..
Be whatever is the name, the underlying agenda is separate state with Hyderabad. Without that no need of separate state. It is shame to call such a selfish motive as a movement for self-respect
Does your discrimination includes region? If you understand the core subject that was people of fighting for all along to enforce a 40% for the region then it will be obvious to call it as discrimination. Then there will be basis to use it in employment, govt industry, resources etc.. and call it as discrimination. You seem to be too smart and get desperate to win every argument but has no heart to understand the aspirations of others.
I might say I can earn and give Rs.100 to every T person. But what they are saying is that let us earn our own Rs. 10 feel the pleasure. Now don't respond saying that who is stoping them which goes back to square one of looking every aspect is hurting the above aspirations. I cannot explain any simpler than this.
The committee secretly suggess political management, media management and goes on to provide ideas to security forces on how to supress the student movement…
Guys, if you are not insensitive to this you have no grounds to reconcile with. The committee is setup to convey peoples voice in an unbiased manner.
@GK,
The committee gave a report in which the views of people of Telangana are very well represented. I would say that inspite of all the data that said no discrimination took place, the committe placed the views of the people in the report. In fact, three of the recommendations favour the demand for Telangana. The 6th option was preferred to avoid lot of complications which will arise if Telangana is outrightly declared without accomodating the views of other areas. Not just, the demands that will arise all over the country on similar lines. Again, I go back to the SC division to highlight what politicians can do. SCs had common reservations for over 60 years. But now a leader comes out saying one section of SCs are marginalised and hence a division is needed in the reservations.
So, dont tell us that the committee was partial, biased, etc…
Look at whats happening in Haryana
Jats want their community to be declared backward. They are threatening to chock off Delhi
I guess India is the only country where ppl agitate to declare themselves as backward
political management – Shameless BJP , T congress leader & TRS and then latter TDP T leaders joined the bandwagon for political gains. It was BJP first which coined one vote, two states, then it was T congress leader & TRS who were politically unemployed joined the solgan and TDP T leaders joined the movement for saving their face in T. So if the heads of these parties had a grip of what was happening and where the things would lead, they would never have supported these leaders.
media management – I would say 9 out of 10 people agree with me that it was media which played an active role in T agitation to provoke people of T region and never bothered to find the truth behind the lies of T leaders. Even today all they do is discuss & analyse some stupid comments made by these leaders and not bothering to find the real facts.
security forces – If the Gov forces and AP police did there job, there wouldn't this much of distruction and damage to public & prvate properties nor demanding commissions from other region people.
GK,
pleas read the judgement carefully. NO NEED TO ENTIRE JUDGEMENT.
Here is the very first point
[ The petitioner is a Practicing Advocate, a former Member of Parliament and A.P. Legislative Assembly. He has also held positions in the Zilla Parishad, Nizamabad District, and was associated with the Agro Industries in different capacities. He filed this writ petition with a prayer to declare that the action of the Union of India, Ministry of Home Affairs (for short ‘the respondent’), in withholding a note on Chapter-VIII (Law and Order and Internal Security Dimensions) (for short ‘the note’) of the report of the Committee for Consultation on the situation in Andhra Pradesh, headed by Sri Justice Srikrishna (hereinafter referred to as ‘the Committee’); as illegal, arbitrary, unreasonable and unconstitutional. Consequential direction to the respondent to furnish the same to him, or to place it on the website of the respondent, is also sought. ]
What is petitioners prayer in Judge's own words? Declaring the action illegal and furnshing the same (chapter -8) to him or in website of the respondent.
Did the petitioner himself argue about content of the chapter?
Did he elicit opinion of Judge on contents of the chapter?
Is it not crossing one's limits?
A sitting judge shows so much activim breaking the delicate relationship of government and Judiciary.
Then what is wrong in a committe passing some advise, even if they are not acceptable to one side ot the other, to the government that appointed it?
MOST IMPORTANTLY why T-vaadis are bothered about SKC report when they rejected it outright?
The Comitte has been unequivocal on my they supported 6th option . They also said that It T state is granted the folks from SA need to be provided adequete protection and now we understand what is the reason behind the stand.
Regarding manipulation of media (T ppl cry SA media is biased+ but it is an open fact in which way the media is biased ..they failed to answer tough questions to T vadis and failed their reponsibility)
BTW TOI is printing the interpretations by the "honble" Judge but I wish they publish the chapter verbatim and let people see the dark forces behing this movement
Folks, See for youself how open the TDF is for people who want to debate and discuss. They denied access just because of the usename I selected.
Your request to join the tdf-charcha group was not approved. The moderator of each Yahoo! group chooses whether to restrict membership in the group. Moderators who choose to restrict membership also choose whom to admit.
I had similar experience at least 3 times. Each time Itried to answer the uestions with some facts ..first they do not publish. When I inquired they simply blocked me.
voiceoftelanga.com.
Can we expected the same kind of democracy in future Telangana?
I question, who is the authority to put forth such questions? Whom are you comparing T with? Are you suggesting T people like don't know what freedom is and you representing the ruler recognized the world?
You are just talking exactly the same way as the Britishers…go back and read the history.
First thing:
Why you try to represent all T people?
You also assume that some of us here represent Samaikyavaadam or all people from other regions.
Now on actual question. You can answer yourself if you understand influence of those particular groups and the role they are going to play in future separate Telangana.
If what was reported in eenadu is correct abt the Judge's statements while giving the verdict, it appears he himself talked like a separtist leader than a unbiased Judge. see these statements.
1) — తెలంగాణ డిమాండ్ ని అంగీకరించకుండా ఈ నివేదిక రూపొందించినట్లుంది
is he indirectly giving signals that the report is anti telangana? Based on comments or secret report in one chapter, does he want to trash the revelations in other chapters reg. bias and discrimination?
2) — కమిటి తనకు నిర్దేశించిన విధి విధానాలకు దూరం గా వెళ్ళింది. ప్రత్యేక తెలంగాణ కు కేంద్రం తలొగ్గకుండా చూడాలన్నట్లుగా నివేదిక ఉంది.
what the Judge did? He made the statements which are no way related to the petitioner's appeal. Does this not overstepping or misusing his authority? When the govt's lawyer himself said the decision of the govt will not be depend on this chapter how can he made the 2nd part of the above statement?
3) — తెలంగాణ కోసం ఆత్మహత్యలు చేసుకున్న విద్యార్ధుల గూర్చి నివేదిక లో ప్రస్తావించలేదు. గత ఏడాది సాగుతున్న ఉద్యమం లో 600 మంది ఆత్మహత్యలకు పాల్పడ్డారు. వీరి గురించి నివేదికలో ప్రస్తావించలేదు.
and now u can understand the intentions. The suicides are mentioned in other chapters.. seems the Hon. Justice want everything in Chapter 8. 600 suicides? whom are we listening? where from he confirmed the number 600?
4) — నగరం నడిబొడ్డున హత్యకు పాల్పడే వారిని పట్టించుకోని పోలీసులు రెచ్చగొట్టారన్న చిన్న కారణం తో వందలాది మంది విద్యార్ధులపై కేసులు నమోదు చేసారు. బెయిల్ పొందేందుకు వీలు లేకుండా చేసారు.
any selective memory loss? is he indirecting suggesting police not to put any cases on students when they are participating in a movement irrespective of whatever they do? how can he talk on the merit of the cases without either taking them for trail or going thru it? btw.. how is it related to the present case? Didnt we see the crores of rupees of public property damaged by these agitators? forget that.. what happend recently on tankbund when police didn't try extra measures to control these mob.
5) ఏదైనా చిన్న సంఘటన జరిగిన ఏకమయ్యే మీడియా ఉస్మానియా లో ఒక విలేఖరి పై దాడి చేసి మోటర్ సైకిలు తగులబెట్టినా వ్యూహాత్మకంగా మౌనం పాటించింది.
– He didn't even leave the media it seems. Actually everyone know it is because of media over acting, minute to minute breaking news, repeated telecasting of emotional visuals hyped the movement and given no chance to administration to know what happening at the base level.
6) — దాడికి కారకుడైన పోలిస్ అధికారిని ప్రభుత్వం 'పదోన్నతీ ఇచ్చి సత్కరించింది.
very mean statement. 1st, the officer himself didnt involved in the attack neither ordered for one but he is the incharge at the scene. 2. his promotion is already under due by then. 3) judge might not know, the officer himself is an alumni of osmania. 4) Might the judge forgot the track record of the officer. 5) Apart from all these, he agreed in court it happen by mistake and given his apologies, and the govt repaid the money for the damages done.
The comments made by the judge regarding the verdict is ridiculous. Its a disgrace for a judge to pass comments abt the content of the report instead of giving judgement whether to release to 8th chapter or not. For me, he is one more separatist who is trying to trash the SKC report.
I guess he has seen enough of suppression against T. If there is nothing wrong in what they wrote than we all should not be bothered by it. I am surprised with folks here bashing the Judge for saying that there should not be any secrets on this subject and that the committee was never asked to provide a secret document.
>> I guess he has seen enough of suppression against T.
If he had seen any, he can step down from the position and may fight against the suppression as an outsider. As an hon. Judge he can't include his personal opinions which are not related to the case and embed them as part of judgement, which is a clear misuse. The govt Appointed lawyer is offered it is upto the judge's descretion to order to reveal the particular chapter. He is neither defending the contents nor the report. so where is the point for the judge to quote the contents?
Satya garu,
Thanks for writing this piece. The Judge definitely has taken a biased view and it is time the Supreme Court looks into the matter. The surprising aspect is these cases to this particular Judge and not any other Judge in the High Court.
Can any body post or give link to Chapter 8 in full ?
Enough of this Judge's interpretation!!!
He did not investigate even one suicide death but mouths of that 600 deaths occured..Where did he get this number from ?? From the Media ???
As far as my knowledge goes there are some journalist who have documented many incidents with pictures, notes, video interviews with the family etc… This is intentionally not being published as per the request by JAC as it could flare up violent reaction. But rest assured one day it will surface and you could see it online I guess.
Normally it is the fundamental right of the grieving party to appeal against the verdict of the judge in a higher court. That is the constitutional right. THis judge clearly misused his power, by cleverly publishing the major portions of the report, in the name of the judgment. All he has to say is that they should publish the report. Now even if supreme court overrules the judge, through his wicked means, he achieved his objective. This is preposterous.
This is how you are blocking the path of reconcilliation. Now you hate the Judge and you are not interested on the core subject that was dealt with? wah-re-wah!
GK, I didn't mind if he releases the contents of the 8th chapter.. But I strongly object stepping beyond the perview of the petetion though appending them in the verdict itself is a kind of going beyond…
. where is the need for him to say 600 suicides or intentions behind the 8th chapter or police commissioner issue and beyond that cases on students… how can he make comments like politician like fake cases on students etc without going thru them officially.
I hope you do not want to support a secret plan to crush freedom of expression from people. It is shame on the committee who suggested/recommended on separating the leaders from people and manipulating etc., inculcating british style scare tactics of communal voilence etc…
I want to give a mouthful to the committee…
[80. The next part is much more startling. It is under the heading “Media Management”. It is also beneficial to read it, and this Court is certain that, not a syllable of it pertains to “Security of State”, much less “Sensitivity”. The only basis for making it secret appears to be that such ideas do not occur to jurists and social scientists and they are not said in public. However, it is not necessary that anything, which cannot be discussed in public, for that very reason must be in the realm of security of state, or that privilege can be claimed about it. The part reads,
(b) Media Management
(i) Andhra Pradesh has got about 13 Electronic Channels and 5 major local Newspapers which are in the forefront of molding the public opinion. Except for two Channels (Raj News & hmtv), the rest of them are supporters of a united Andhra Pradesh. The equity holders of the channels except the above two and the entire Print Media are with the Seemandhra people. The main editors/resident and sub-editors, the Film world etc. are dominated by Seemandhra people. A coordinated action on their part has the potential of shaping the perception of the common man. However, the beat journalists in the respective regions are locals and are likely to capture only those events/news which reflect the regional sentiments.
(ii) Hyderabad city which is expected to be the center of most of the agitations is generally covered by those journalists who are votaries of a separate Telangana. Hence a lot of media hype on the Osmania University Students agitation, self-immolations etc. may be created. Therefore, media management assumes critical importance to ensure that only the reality is projected and no unnecessary hype is created. In the immediate past, it is observed that the media coverage on the issue has shown a declining trend resulting in a lower intensity of the agitation. Each of the media houses are affiliated to different Political Parties. In the Print Media all major Newspapers are owned by Seemandhra people and the Regional contents published by them play a vital role. Most of the editors except Andhra Jyothi are pro-united A.P. However, similar to the electronic channels, the print media have also got political affiliations. The editorial opinions, the banner headlines, the Regional content, the District editions need to be managed to be realistic and should give only due coverage to the separate Telangana agitations.”
]
GK,
above is the exact text of the judgement available at http://hc.ap.nic.in/orders/wp_1569_2011.html
Can you enlighten us how this can be concluded as AGAINST TELANGANA?
And then whether one should call it as plan to crush freedom of expression?
BTW, I am brining media specific points as you raised "crush freedom of expression".
If you mean some more points, I can discuss them too.
what is objective of keeping it secret?
Dec9th, 2009 – Time 11.20 p.m. Centre makes a statement favoring Telangana Statehood. (as a Result of peoples aspirations and SA politicians agreeing to vote in favor of Resolution on Telangana on Dec7th, 2009)
Dec 10th, 2009 – TIme 10 A.m. Most of SA MALA's Resign their MLA Posts
i.e., In a short duration of 11 hours (That too at night) an udyamam Called "Samaikyavaadam" suddently arose & built to such a level that more than 100 M.L.A's Representating the people resigned and few Persons gets up from their sleep and starts running with Unity torch in their hands – All this needs to be believed and these are the persons that always try to malign an agitation that is few decades old.
Looking at few lines of Chapter 8 one should clearly understand that this SKC operated from the Pockets of Greedy SA Lobby that are even today not ready to mend their crooked ways. Once again this should be understood in a broader sense and the class of Greedy SA Lobby includes the likes of Lagadapatis, Rayapatis, Kavuris, YSJ's, Mekapatis & their Chamchas etc that Exploit Telangana day in and Out.
Allegations like Future Telangana would become a home of Naxals or Hyderabad becoming an epicenter for Communal clashes etc were heard time and again from the mouth of Lagadapati & his chamchas. SKC reported the same. That did not cause a surprise to me. What really mattered was the way they suggested crooked ways of handling the people’s aspirations. Their suggestions itself are a clear proof that they are sold for bucks and made a fortune at the expense of millions of Telanganites long cherished struggle.
Even today if someone is at the helm of supporting the shameless suggestions of SKC like media management, giving plum posts or incentives to crooks like CP Anjaneyulu as answer to the Democratic demands of the People, then Alas Mr. GK it’s high time for us to get out of this illogical loop of intellectuals on this website.
There are 25 MP's from Andhra-Seema region and all the T people talk about or traget 4 MP's who are also industrialists. Why don't you take about the reamining 20 MPs'.
@UT,
your comment: “In a short duration of 11 hours (That too at night) an udyamam Called “Samaikyavaadam” suddently arose & built”
Samaikyandhras dont need to be on udyamam since the current status itself is what they want, that is the state is lying united, You dont fight for something when you already have what you want. so your statement that udyamam rose suddenly is rediculus…:)
According to you, the India should keep on fighting for independence even after having indepedence. When there is a threat to our countries sovernity, and if people wake up to that and start a udyamam, according to your policy, we should suspect that udyamam becuase it suddenly arose..:) god give some wisdom to you….
Every member of SKC are highly educated and intelluctuals and are able to understand,interpret and extrapolate demand for T with much more clarity than any of your uneducated singing heros like gaddar, rasamayi, deasapthi,,,,kodandaram..or KCR and his family.These jackals are taking uneducated poeple of 10 districts like YOU and created a FALSE IDENTITY called TELENGANA that never existed except as legacy of croocked foregin rule of persians.
Please belive in intelluctuals and not pseudo intelluctuals or politicians for YOUR OWN SAFETY.
Dont get carried away by apsirations of 4 crores people, etc., In reality 80% people are so much uneducated they dont even propely know what a state or country means.
Your gaddar or those naxal singers have no job and they have some psycological problems and emotions with word ‘udyamam’. Ask your self the meaning of word udyamam….you will not be able to answer it at one point.. The more you talk about naxals fancied rubbish terms like udyamam etc., the more you remain backward. There are four rules to scucess:
Enterprising attitude
hardworking attitdue
Remaining tied to our heritage and culture
keeping way from bad habbits such as alcohal
let every T work on those 4 rules, in 5 years time they can outsmart every race.
@Mohan Kurella,
Sentence of yours " These jackals are taking uneducated poeple of 10 districts like YOU and created a FALSE IDENTITY called TELENGANA that never existed except as legacy of croocked foregin rule of persians.' – Needs a Clarification
I never knew that a Person by name Mohan Kurella Should sign my Masters Degree in Physics and until then I would be considered uneducated.
keeping way from bad habbits such as alcohal – This comment tells me about your Personality and character.
I dont call someone educated simply becuase they paper certificates. It is abilities to think, analsyse and interpret that makes someone educated. If You were educated, you would not have made a comment, samaikyandra movement arose suddenly.
As I said, we dont have to fight for independence any more since we already have independence. Same is the case with samaikyandra. There is no need to have udyamam when we already have samaikyandra. The moments comes up only only it is foiled. So susupsecting samaikyandra movement motives by syaing that it suddenly arose , makes no sense. Thats were I consider peoople like you 'uneducated'
If one has to make a good progress in career and life,no doubt he has to keep away from bad habits. Not just me.. everybody tell that….so.. I am surprised why did you have to care to asess my character and personality when I said a universal truth,(gummadi kaya dongalu bhujalu tadumkuntunnara?)
UT,
how long you people fools youselves with silly arguments?
How a movement is possible in 11 hours? In opposition to a 60 year old movement which is very active for a decade.
I know your logic will answer that greedy SA achieved that.
But you fail to understand how economically sections/group hit will react.
T movement has failed time and again on the same account.
T-vaadis could never project its as bread and butter issue.
GK, UT, Prakash.
What was "shocking" to you in the "secret" report of Sri Krishna ? Is it that he said what he said (and did not shut up and behave like a baanchan to telangana doras and did not say "nee kalmoktha") or is it what he actually said ?
Regarding the first part it is a commitee sanctioned by and reporting to union home ministry and not sanctioned by some Dora in telangana. It is up to union home ministry to decide what to take cognizance of and what to ignore.
Second part (on what was actually said ) is very reasonable to me. If Home ministry asks me on what I think of a "movement" which presents clear harm to people I will suggest how to remove the harm.
The only "shocker" here is Justice Narasimha Reddy and his sneaky behaviour in leaking the report without the necessary administrative sanction. I reckon that his buffonery will go to where it is destined – the dust bin.
Regards,
Kiran
Kiran,
sorry for correcting you.
Prakash has not yet made any comment on Judgement.
Let us hope he will not come-up with "I do not like any Judgements on anything".
Guys,
I think a lot of space in the discussion forum is wasted responding to UT, GT (I too have done). They guys have not educated us in anyway about telangana movement and perhaps have no clue about the different streams in telangana that are influencing this movement.
I found the destruction of statues on tank bund a fascinating episode. The people who did first showed what they thought of politcians like KCR, KK, Yashki, Harish Rao on where they actually stand and how the "movement" can easily slip out of those politicians hands who plan to profit the most from it. It was a huge blow to KCR and he needs to realize this is no 1969. People are not going to worship any politician for any fake fights he puts him in ac tv studios and in front of cameras. It also showed what can happen and how quickly things can go out of the control of even TRS and BJP politicians once they rely on hate based identity politics as a route to power.
Coming to actual statue breaking I think many people here reacted with too much unnecessary anguish. Some T proponenets were correct statues are not people. Also it is fascinating to look at the choice of statues broken by the protestors. All figures representing hindu sampradayam were broken ( brahmin and kamma personalities). They spared alluri sita rama raju – though an "upper" caste he lived and worked with tribals. If he had some statues of eminent Telugu dalits there would they have gone so angry ?
I want people who visit the blog to think here – there were some past acheivements in telugu society but there is lot of disgust there – the casteism, they way our ancestors treated dalits, women, youth etc. Some of the protestors belonged to CPI new democracy and many of the are from dalit and BC communities. There is a real anger with which I empathize against the caste system derived oppression mechanisms. Samaikyavadam should not be confined to defending status quo and past "greatness" come what may. Our Telugu culture lives in fishermans "hylessa" and dalit women lullabies as well which our society in the past treated with contempt. If we can work with the same passion against the monstoristies of traditionalism we can take a lot of wind from misdirected movements like Telangana.
Regards,
Kiran
@ Kiran, You seems to be no different than the ones that u are opposing. One coins regionalism and u are doing casteism. u want to join the brand of hate politics? Come up with some list of dalits and demand the govt to put their statues are also on tank bund. seems at one point Prakash is correct. and ofcourse, we the people of India struggling without understanding the meaning of democracy which doesn't mean percentages, ratios etc..
u felt fascinated seeing the statues of brahmin & kamma personalities broken? How shame 1st to see the caste in those statues. which caste is cotton? who is gurram jashua? The common thread that binds them all is, their service to telugu people. Tomorrow one may come and say telugu talli is the mother for brahmin and kamma community.
None of those ppl preached the hindu sampradayam or did service to a caste. In fact, it is the other way. They challenged the false customs of those days and encouraged dalit and women education. and fought against untouchability, and for upliftment of downtrodden.
Kiran,
we are in the days of "తిన్నామా-పడుకున్నామా-తెల్లారిందా"
So any kind of pride does not make sense here.
Yet the same time one cannot be selective about pride or no-pride.
In fact there is no need for Samaikyavaadam in the first place.
Why not the state be divided on economical lines? That was the eventual goal, rigt?
It is impossible to convince anybody on importance of 'pride' in couple of Paragraphs.
Whereas it is easy to blame history and historical persons.
What about present society? How much did it progress since times of thise 'oppressors'?
Could India stop using terms 'caste' and 'religion' officially? Why not?
Did any of Modern economic Gurus like Narayana Murthy, Ambanis or social activists Medha patkar, Teesta Steetalvad or world renowned author Arudhanti roy anybody, just anybody successful or famous ever requested the government of India to de-recognize the caste/religion system?
For the matter those you symphathize. Did they ever make similar demand? Did any of the left parties and so called secular parties ever put a such promise in their manifestos?
Being radical does not mean just opposing everything that is wrong or appears wrong.
But finding a way to correct the wrongs.
Since now the secret chapter of SKC is also "leaked" by "respected" judge of high court of AP, Now, I request all Telangana separatists to calm down a bit and think with brain. Not with emotion. All emotion should be exhausted by now.
Sri krishna comitte report completely worked towards the benifit of Telangana region. Thats an important observation one has to make.
They least cared about the future of coastal and seema districts if AP is divided. They hardly mentioned the consequences in the point of view of Seemandhra districts. But they always sympathized with Telangana districts future.
They want telangana people to understand that, eventhough peoples aspirations have increased after dec 9th statement, one should think about the consequences of separating telangan regions also.
Please note that they did not say all people asking T are naxalas. They said , if T formed , naxalas will take advantage of this and other serious consequences , T people will have to handle.
In the best interest of Telangana region, and future of every Telangana child, Justice Sri krishna comitte suggested United AP.
I request all T-vadi's to calm down and come for talks, about how govt of AP and govt of India can more develop T and give more political space for T politicians.
Chandra,
it is very unfortunate that T-vaadis blinded with hatred.
They could not even understand and accept the statements made in thier support.
Look at point 80 in the Judgement.
Even ordiniary English reader understands that comment is AGAINST media owned by SA and need for ensuring real and due coverage to T agitation.
But our learned judge concludes it as direction to center to 'Manage Media' against T agitation.
It was really shocking to see o many people like Ghanta Chakrapani, Srinivasa Reddy, host of laywers drawing great conspiracy theory from those few (misinterpreted) lines.
I think the best slogan now would be
SAVE TELANGANA FROM SICK PEOPLE.
"The only "shocker" here is Justice Narasimha Reddy and his sneaky behaviour in leaking the report without the necessary administrative sanction."
Bingo, there was clearly lot of agitation in tone and tenor of the judge when he mentioned about 600 suicides in Telangana like any other politician. There is a conflict of interest. The Center should have been given the opportunity to appeal against the verdict,till then in all fairness the judge should not have revealed the contents. The report has to be read in its entirety to understand the context of what was said. By selectively commentary on the report,the people would naturally be agitated. The Court cannot comment on the veracity of the claims the panel has stated since it didn't go to field and have consultations at grassroot level.Unless it is privy to another committee report which has done similar work it cannot comment on the veracity of the original panel.
The cases pertaining to Telangana should be adjudicated in another state's high court since there could be bias in AP.
Quoting suicides is "in-thing" in Telangana. Courts and Judges are no exception.
Till date I could not understand this aspect of T movement.
In war degree of valor is determined where the soldier fights and dies. "Paramveer chakra" awarded only if soldier wins/dies in presence of enemy.
Warlords take pride in number of enemies they killed before getting killed.
Rebels seek Martyrdom by dying at the hands of oppressor.
Women (in olden days maybe) get respect when they commit suicide to protect their chastity.
But T movement stands unique in world.
Kids were instigated to commit suicide and then others glorify them as Martyrs.
Unfortunately even judges.
SAVE TELANGANA FROM SICK PEOPLE.
Prabhakara Rao says: March 25, 2011 at 12:43 am
"Prakash has not yet made any comment on Judgement."
I have not read it yet. Not sure if I will get the time to do so as I am swamped on both work & home fronts.
"Let us hope he will not come-up with "I do not like any Judgements on anything""
Let me protect my status as a "big picture" person by offering a quick comment. I am opposed to "cloak-and-daggger" approach. A collective (such as Govt.) has no business hiding things from its "masters" (i.e. citizens). Narayana Murthy's dictum "if in doubt, disclose" should be the norm unless there are very strong demonstrable reasons for maintaining confidentiality.
I have no hesitation in saying that the Judge order to the disclosure of Chapter VIII is correct. However, his other comments are unwarranted and must be seen as misuse of judiciary by an indvidual.
Prakash gaaru,
it is unfortunate to discuss actions of a HC judge. But we have no option.
I fully agree with your opinion and NM's dictum. But this particular Judge did not follow any particular norm.
Either judge could have stopped at passing the order to publish the chapter with selective comments. Or he could have published the entire report for himself.
By being selective and (mis)intepreting the contents he has proven me correct about the 'ailment' I am talking about.
Now it has spread to even judiciary and definitely eat Telangana very badly, if not stopped
I do not think India can live and progess with so many SICK people even in high-cricles in heartland of the country.
There is always scope and hope for a economically weak soceity to progress.
But for a MENTALLY ill soceity, only way is down.
I pray center stops this degeneration further and divides the state for the sake of these SICK people to recover soon.
Kiran says: March 24, 2011 at 4:42 pm
Wonderful comment. I especially commend the last (fourth) paragraph which I found to be extremely well thought out. Comments like this enhance the prestige of this blog. Thank you sir!
One factual reminder may be in order though. As I understand, Jashuva's statue was not spared. To me this does not sync well with your third paragraph.
satya says: March 25, 2011 at 4:27 am
"One coins regionalism and u are doing casteism"
Yes and some see language or state. Yet others may see religion (e.g. idolatory or shirk). This is based on perception & "identity politics".
"u want to join the brand of hate politics?"
Please.. Let us avoid the trap of branding people just because we disagree with their views.
"None of those ppl preached the hindu sampradayam or did service to a caste"
With due respect, this is a sweeping generalization. Many of these preached specific religious schools of thought.
Prakash gaaru,
It goes like this
1. You find a visible "wrong". Nobody can defend it as right. Simple example "a mother not feeding his child".
2. Do not give scope for explanation and studing the circuimstances. Ex: "why mother was not feeding the child". Insist only on end effect. We are at square one. There is a victim and there is an offender as perceived by the accusor.
3. Throw couple of more accusations. "Mother ate entire food". "Did mother really had the food or not to feed one or both"? Nay! Nobody cares after all there is a victiom and visible.
4. Now the kid starts beating the mother and even tearing her saree. Mother applies force in the kid. The accusor justifies kid's actions. "After all he is hungry and entitled to beat you".
5. Mother truns angry and demands the accusor "tell me did you feed your kids"
6. Accusor say "Do not shoot messenger! How does it matter what I did. After all you are culprit and do justice to your kid". "Otherwise we will take away kid and drop in Orphange".
PS: there is a term to define this kind of behavior. Some kind of "crime" or "terrorism". I forgot it but will comeback when recollect.
Expected ur presence here… language identity doesn't have its foundations on hatred but uniqueness. anyways.. u seems to be happy for finding fissures btwn proponents of integrated state. a chance for divide and win
@Prabhakar: not clear whether you are responding to the previous comment or something else. Looks interesting though.
It is inresponse to your
Please.. Let us avoid the trap of branding people just because we disagree with their views.
I only gave a simple example of how to influence minds AGAINST based on an apperant "wrong".
Kiran was trying to oppose "Telugu greatness" bcoz some or others in past (or even now) "wronged" dalits. It was undeniable fact. So you start hating historical figures (and demoslih their statues). Then he will move onto Telugu pride is ant-social… Now somebody else joins and say entire Telugu community in the world are vaillains.
You maybe surprised why I replied to your post.
Time and again you too demonstrate similar intelligence.
Prabhakara Rao says: March 25, 2011 at 5:39 am
"But this particular Judge did not follow any particular norm"
I have heard other allegations earlier too. I believe there are enough avenues inside the judicial system to check abuse. Perhaps it is time to invoke these?
"By being selective and (mis)intepreting the contents he has proven me correct about the 'ailment' I am talking about."
I think it is short lived. If the full contents are published as directed (or ought to have been without intervention), the clarity would improve.
Prakash Sir,
I think this short lived…
This is where my above story applies.
A sitting judge accuses bias on a committee report. People club it with basis of existing movement.
Now 2+2=4. What judge said is right and the view spreads among T supporters.
It goes on until GOI or SC take a decision. By then nobody cares what is the actual truth. By now people believe and accept committee report is wrong.
Many T supporters including big political analysts like Srinivasa Reddy Ganta Chakrapani etc have not even tried to understand the extracts produced by Judge. They went on debating only judge comments as if they were right.
You can see how each and every politican from T area started calling SKC names.
Please see extract of judgement on point 80 in above comments.
PS: Justice Dinakarn and CJ KG Balakrishnan have done enough damage to reputation of judiciary. I do not see any reason to get into how it works. This estate is also slowly realising its potential to play same role as other two estates.
@ Prabhakar,
As per my understanding Your main Objection is on Discussions ( On contents of Chapter 8 of SKC Report) by Professor Gata Chakra pani & Political Analysts like Srinivas Reddy etc supporting the judgement & thereby passing comments that SKC report is baised.
Your concerns would have got more weightage if you would have passed on similar concerns with the bloggers on this site making for & against reactions on the reamaining eight chapters of SKC verdict well before the GOI took decision starting with the Title of the Article as " Vindicated".
UT,
so you make me ineligible for discussion on this bcoz I did not debate the original report.
Are you sure I did not debate the article "Vindicated"?
I am ready to explain my concern on both items.
Can you please explain Judge's comment on Point 80 "Media Managememnt"? Know why?
Most of discussion on HM TV on 23rd was around this point. Both Chakrapani and Srinivasareddy analyzed and talked at length on a Paragraph that hardly 10 lines.
Interestingly Varla Ramayya asked the moderator a question "Do you have copy of Chapter 8 with you?"
Please note:
Your concerns would have got more weightage if you would have passed on similar concerns
Why? Why should I pass same concerns on everything?
For me they are totally different. If you still do not get, here it is.
SKC is neother legal nor constitutional and there is no binding on their recommendation and even suggestion. There is enough scope for anybody to reject, oppose and even call names.
Whereas comments of HC judge may end up as "PRECEDENTS" (see how judges use PRECEDENTS in delivering judgments) and difficult to even contest them legally.
Evidently T proponents are using these comments to promote their cause and deepen the hatred.
UT,
BTW what is your view on point 80?
You may consider me ineligible for debate. But you can increase you rating by responding to specific point.
The reasons explained by the Judge to include parts of the report in the judgement are:
"However, the reasons, that prompted this Court to make the supplementary note as part of the judgment; are,
a) section 3(4) of the 1952 Act makes it obligatory on the part of the Government to make every report of Commission/Committee, public;
b) the report submitted by the Vohra Committee, which was constituted on the same lines, as Justice Srikrishna Committee, i.e., not invoking specific provisions of the 1952 Act; was made public, though the very object of the Committee was to look into the sensitive issues pertaining to security of State;
c) The Committee herein was not assigned any task of analyzing security aspects;
d) the very exercise undertaken by the committee was in the light of a public demand on different directions and open enquiry, involving every stakeholder and that the contents of the note are of general importance; are needed to discuss certain fundamental issues, pertaining to public law domain; and
e) the committee was not assigned any private or political functions. It was constituted by issuing a notification in the gazette. In the floor of the Parliament, it was stated that about Rs.20 crores was spent upon it.
Can anyone explain me how these 5 points can be a justification to include the contents in the judgement? I agree They can be reason for ordering the govt to publish the report. But where is the need for including them in the verdict? The petetioner himself didn't asked for that. May be the judge given more justice than he sought for
Wow.. Other highly objectionable comments which became part of judgement.
84. In a writ petition filed by the victimized girls, this Court summoned the officer. He admitted in the open Court, that the beating of the journalist; burning of motorcycle, and pouring of urine by the constables occurred in his presence. The media, which unites to protest against even small ill-treatment of a journalist; unfortunately maintained strategic silence, and the individual had to fight the litigation by himself. The officer was rewarded with a promotional posting of ‘Commissioner’ at a different place. The patronage of the state, or by the support he has received from those, who run the State is such that, within a week after he was found, having sent objectionable SMS to a woman; was further promoted.
1) see the usage of words. Ther officer was rewarded
Like an ordinary person, a judge is trying to link two separate events and cooking some emotional story. He is trying to portray that because the officer is part of the incident, he was rewarded with promotion.
2) The last line, of the 2nd paragraph made me blown away. It is really sad to see a judge trying to malign the character of a police officer based on a tv story, though the woman in picture didn't filed a single complaint against him.
Was he ( The Great Mr. Anjaneyulu)demoted or Promoted?
"The TV visuals can be taken as evidence" – You must be aware of this simple point. Further could you make it clear if you beleive that Mr. Anajaneyulu is the best police officer and very clean. Is it not true that he admitted the guilt before the judge!
What do want to call this promotion, Reward or Award?
>> “The TV visuals can be taken as evidence”
Thank you, Let the learned Judge sentence him for 14 yrs based on a TV Program.
TV or camera visuals can be taken only to identify the persons to prove at the site of the offence… that too live visuals. not a cooked stories for political interest. And TV visuals let alone can’t prove the entirety. If so, we would have hanged kasab by now. You must learn the complex points of how judiciary functions.
>> Further could you make it clear if you beleive that Mr. Anajaneyulu is the best police officer and very clean.
u can better ask rowdy elements in Guntur, Vijayawada and faction elements in kurnool dists. why till there? u can ask the osmania rowdies too
>> Is it not true that he admitted the guilt before the judge!
I said he did.. That is why the govt compensated the loss to the person. what else should be done? do the officer need to do a sastanga namaskara or what? or do he need to be dismissed from police force? or should he be thrown in the jail?
Govt Promotions or rewards will be given considering the long track record of the officers. not for burning a scooter. you must know these simple facts.
Fyi…
Even District Judges award punishment to police officers when they show disrespect to court. Know kind of punishments? Officer will asked to STAND until end of court session.
Do not believe me? Ask inumerable laywers in T agitation.
Now why that Judge did not order SUSPENSION of that Individual in first place? When he has enough "Visual Evidence"?
BTW, judge might have felt that particular Individual was anti-Telangana.
But that individual's behavior is not different In Vijayawada either. Once again he was transferred on pomotion.
Another provocative comment to intensify the agitators.
The Government wanted a peaceful solution to this situation. The Committee, however, had a different thing in mind. Those who fed the committee with inaccurate information and projections should have realized that, if real bullets that killed 369 persons could not suppress the demand, rubber bullets may not achieve that goal.
Does he meant the govt killed 369 ppl to suppress the movement?
Yes, the 1969 Firing under Kasu Brahamanand reddy's leadership Killed 369 Students in firing. Again a fact that you do not try to endore is blindfolding yourself. The demand of yesteryears rose up to the limelight again in the recent days.
UT, if ppl go on vandalizing the private and public property, moving in as mobs when 144 section was there one cant do anything if all the options went out of hand. Also there is a history of violence and targeting a region people during the movement. If the govt sit idle and allowed the mob to create mayhem, who will be blamed?
If kasu ordered for 369 ppl killing, did PVNR took revenge by killing of 350 ppl in jai andhra movement?
@GK,
NO ONE is objecting the judges order to make the VIII chapter public. But his comments are a total abuse of his position. The decay of morals and abuse of power has spread from the politicians to govt employees and now to the judiciary. Irresponsible and has created a dangerous precedent.
I may have to live in Hyderabad for the rest of my life but I can tell you there is enough hatred created in me against the people of Telangana. The leaders may think that once Telangana is created, they can issue some reconciling statements but the damage done already is much more.
AMRAO,
I am going to live rest of my life in Hyderabad.
But I do not worry about these leaders and I DO NOT SEE any reason to hate people of Telangana. Nor I will care the re-concilliation.
All these SICK people together are a minority. Of course at present they are very vocal.
Prabhakara Rao garu,
I accept that few people who have knowledge and sense of judgment on what is correct and what wrong and control their emotions is fine. But what about the other people. if the seed of enmity is planted in brain it is not easy to erase. Just think if the educated people of telangana are speaking this much enmity what about a lay man who has a very limited source of information. just think of people who damaged their own mother statue(telangana talli) just thinking it will help the moment how much hatred is there in their brain.
One more for your Kind perusal:
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/hyderabad/Telangana-panels-credibility-chapter-closed/articleshow/7783321.cms
Most `T' supporters or even those who support a united Andhra, said they had no great expectations from the committee report but were shocked at the way it had overstepped its mandate and succumbed to political lobbying.
UT,
please try to think before you poke at others.
1. T-vaadis rejected SKC report.
2. Even united Andhra supporters objected to them crossing the limits.
3. Maybe (read maybe) center too felt that SKC crossed limits and withheld a part of the report.
Then why you are bothered about what is there in the report?
What is that T-vaadis proved by making chapter-8 public?
Put yourself in shoes of an Indian outside AP.
In future they will quote this chapter to highlight Naxalism in TG.
Exactly the way many T-vaadis quote SRC, Ambedkar, Bhargava Committe, Bachawat etc.
Who would care the contraversy? No one. They will accept the contents on the case based Srikrishna's reputation.
It si proved that T gaitation is fighting against a powerful Greedy lobby who could stoop down to any level of degrading themselves to meet their hunger. The 8th chapter would eventually prove how SKc was sold out and everyone should demand the prosecution of these brutal forces that are acting against the spirit of our Democracy. Further Justice Narsimha Reddy should be congratuled for his Historic Judgement.
ya.. I understood to what level they can stoop down when they themselves burnt the statue of telangana talli to malign their political opponents… we know to what level they can stoop down, when harish rao who fiercely fight against the lands given to Zee telefilms had no where talked about it after it is showing ‘positive’ news on agitation. We understood to what level they can stoop down when they attacked JP with a grudge because he talked about vasool rajas in the agitation. We know the level of this udyamam, when they attacked the person who just wrote a book that shatters the lies of the siddantakartalu. we know the value given to martyrs when fake cheques were distributed to their families and the filthiest display of character by the student leader right in TV studio. we know the professor who is leading the JAC, let his son happily studying abroad but spoiling the careers of the students with a boycott call for everything.. need more examples?
Udyama Telangana says:
March 25, 2011 at 3:05 pm
One more for your Kind perusal:
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/hyderabad/Telangana-panels-credibility-chapter-closed/articleshow/7783321.cms
Most `T' supporters or even those who support a united Andhra, said they had no great expectations from the committee report but were shocked at the way it had overstepped its mandate and succumbed to political lobbying.
They are not TRS leaders to succumb to political lobbying. They have nothing to gain by dividing or keeping united AP. It was dispassionate analysis of the truth and a candid way to solve the problem without offending people on either side. You guys need to stop the habit of bad mouthing everybody that opposes separate T. In fact it is T separatists that did more lobbying almost 10:1 ratio than integrationists. . Over and above they intimidated SKC with garjanas, marches and all other shananigans. SKC completely understood the political opportunism that is driving the movement and knowing what satiates the appetite of political opportunists, he suggested possible ways to deal with them.
UT,
Off topic ..but relevant to seperatists how they exaggerate facts. In this blog I once mentioned how APs population can not be more than 8.5 cr and Telangana about 3.5 cr.
Now the results are out today. AP population is 8.46 cr. Even if u take Telangana is 42% (earlier it was only 40%) of it it would be around 3.55 cr. Can you at least stop exaggerating it to be 4 cr (4.5 cr according to Prof.Kodandaram.!.)
@UT, I do subscribe to the opinion that the committee has given the ‘suggestions’ which are not the part of their terms and reference. but then here comes the crucial question…. did they do it voluntarily? for me a BIG NO. u may see conspiracy, and seemandhra money power whichever appears to be not in ur favor…. But No committee can dare to give such suggestions if the govt is not asked for… That is why in the report they said they discussed some of the points during their interaction with chidambaram in sep 2010.
I personally feel there is no need of media management and other managements if people are willing to listen to facts without getting emotional.Otherwise tomorrow some other x,y,z do the same and we need to follow the same manipulations. instead educate the people so that they wont follow these separatists.
But is this possible? It will tarnish the image of political parties for spreading lies and become the cause for suicides, ultimately effects them in elections. so are they willing to bare such loss? again NO. That is why they suggested these things to apply from background so that there wont be any loss for the,. May be the committee become little diplomatic here.
Finally, they did both the things.
a) revelation of facts in their 7 chapters
b) a political suggestions to get rid of the situation without or minimal effect on the parties. That is why they said soothing of TRS, control congress MLAs etc..
Satya,
I think what SKC means by media management is asking media to show raw facts rather than all the time glorifying T agitation, which is what media has been doing for the past 1.5 years. That needs to be obviously controlled for the peace and harmony in the society. Media is a part of society not beyond law and constitution.
Prabhakara Rao says: March 25, 2011 at 9:36 am
satya says:
"Kiran was trying to oppose "Telugu greatness" bcoz some or others in past (or even now) "wronged" dalits"
I read his comment (especially the fourth paragraph) differently. He was calling for more inclusiveness. He acknowledged the achievements and stated the negatives. "there were some past acheivements in telugu society but there is lot of disgust there – the casteism, they way our ancestors treated dalits, women, youth etc." Even his "Samaikyavadam should not be confined to defending status quo and past "greatness" come what may" is a plea for extending the base rather than exclusive.
"u seems to be happy for finding fissures btwn proponents of integrated state. a chance for divide and wi"
Au contraire, I am trying to bridge them. Kiran has made a forceful point in favor of "integration" that can only add to your "cause".
PS: I remember someone referring to Kufr earlier. Kufr is one of the few dalit voices supporting united AP. His stand integrates well into his general overview.
Prakash garu, I haven’t denied the oppressions on dalits and other backward communities in the past. For that matter, that is not a phenomenon happend in india or in andhra pradesh. as I told earlier, no race can be spared of that. again, I do not want to go into details of who did and why those happen and who are the victims which becomes the complex topic ever discussed in human history
But I do not see a dalit in ambedkar or a brahmin in kandukuri or a vaisya in potti srirarumulu and get fascinated by seeing their statues demolishment. definitely that is not a thing for a party.
Prakaash gaaru,
అవధానంలో అప్రస్తుత ప్రసంగం అంటే ఇదే.
We cannot mourn each and every death on the earth.
Almost every public action in this country can be diverted to cate or religious discrimination. The least gender discrimination. That is the history and nobody can change it.
ఆవు మీద వ్యాసం లాగా
But main focus of present movement and this blog is division of AP.
And this particular act of vandalism was done in the name of TG movement. Bring caste factor and you can justify anything. Even Hyderabad as separate state.
I do not see any need for Samaikyavaadam embracing even social aspects. (My apologies for my assertion) For two reasons
first, inclusiveness is bound become baggage.
second, this Samaikyavaadam is an ad-hoc gathering to correct a wrong being done. Whereas the other problems pointed by Kiran can be eradicated only by sustained campaign.
BTW, yesterday some TV channel is showing a school building (actually a couple of rooms) that was left uncared for. On either side of the mainroom there are two paintings. Godess Saraswati on left side and Dr. Sarvepalli Radhakrishnan on right side.
A funny thought came to be. What would Kiran or Prakash would comment on that.
Former "why a brahmin guru only" and latter "I do not support any type of paintings on school walls".
Prabhakar garu, thats a nice write-up.
>> I do not see any need for Samaikyavaadam embracing even social aspects.
This may trigger Prakash garu to come up with his epic 5 point criteria for division or being united.
1.అవధానంలో అప్రస్తుత ప్రసంగం అంటే ఇదే.
2."I do not support any type of paintings on school walls".
Just for the record:
1.The police officer's posting as commisioner, vijayawada was NOT a promotion. He was a DIG and went there in the same rank.
2. The incidents of motor cycle burning etc did NOT happen in his presence. He told the same thing in court. However, being the senior most officer present, he voluntarily took responsibility.
3. In the same series of incidents, one IG rank officer got his wrist nerve cut by stone throwing and it took two months to heal.
4. The CRPF personnel were about to enter the hostels and beat up the students for all the stone throwing they had suffered. The senior police officers had to struggle to stop the CRPF men from doing that.
5. In any case, it is obvious that the writ petition had nothing to do with the allegations against the police officers
6. The police officer taking moral responsibility was like some judge taking moral responsibility for the vandalism indulged in by lawyers inside high court. Of course no judge did that.
7. Curiously, the judge did not mention anything about the vandalism indulged in by T lawyers in high court.
@Neutral, Though this is off topic, I think he is there as a joint commissioner before transferred to vijayawada as a commissioner.
Kodandaram, the popular name that rings in Telangana Movement was once upon a time a respectable teacher. People assumed that his approach towards the movement and the people of Andhra Pradesh on a whole will be matured and inspiring. ‘But he was turned as a terrorist’, say journalists.
The journalists of all News Papers and the freelancers, irrespective of their regions, planned to gather at Ravindra Bharati tomorrow (Sunday morning 10 AM) to stage a condolence for the pillaged statutes on Tank Bund. The agenda of the meeting is not to put down Telangana movement, but only to condemn the loss of heritage. For this, the journalists have scheduled a photo exhibition of the statues before and after attack, a condolence meeting and a peaceful march in the premises.
Knowing this Kodandaram called journalists and terrorized with violent sentences. Despite explaining the course of action, Kodandaram warned the journalists not to carry any photo exhibition and condolence speeches. He said that condition will become severe and journalists have to taste the violence of T-activists.
“If any photo exhibition is carried with regard to Tank Bund statues and if any body opens mouth and condemns the destruction of statues, we don’t spare. We will beat them on the spot without any mercy. No body should dare to oppose us. All that we permit is to carry a silent march at the premises. We don’t allow opening mouths and carrying photo exhibitions”, was the telephonic warning by Kodandaram to journalists.
Since Kodandaram called and warned, journalists gave a big laugh and going ahead to carry the program as they planned without any change. We have to see who will do what!!
@Prakash
Thanks for your appreciation. It was a very polite and civilized thing to do knowing that I d'ont agree with you on many things.
@satya
Regionalism and castesim are two sides of the same coin ? really ? It is not appropriate to be so flippant of that curse of Indian society – casteism. Caste was an institutionalized discrimination practised in hindu society backed by nothing less than its holiest scriptures. It is recognized in our constitution and even acknowledged by UN. Its effects are all pervasive in Indian society - Most of dalits, tribals are dirt poor and denying them justice and dignity is still a routine affair in the vast countryside of India.
On the other hand "regionalism" of telangana garden variety is uterly meaningless, divisive rhetoric spewed by some dora politicians for extremely narrow and personal gains. It was neither backed by history nor by tradition and infact is such silly i_diotic thing that my fingers are reluctant to type about this mischief.
All I was suggesting in my post is that the corrosive effects of casteism and the anger and rage it generates among its victims is being channelled in to this telangana nonsense. This is not good for anyone including KCR who thinks he can manage this anger by exactly limiting it to issues which bring him personal profit – he got a rude jolt on telangana march. Thats what many of the comments section here are missing by focussing on responses of KCRites like UT, GK – there is more to tankbund march than simple KCR vs Andhra people or telangana vs andhra. I did not and do not endorse statutue breaking – I am surprised you have concluded that way.
And samaikyavaadis need to talk about these if this were not to be seen as a club of rich coastal industrialists (this is how it is being painted by radical telangana activitists) we need to talk about the many faces of telugu society in all regions – dalits, women, poor, religious minorities and issues that effect them and how by being united we can address them better. We cannot take a silly schoolboyish "out of topic" attitude ot social issues.
Regards,
Kiran
Caste was an institutionalized discrimination practised in hindu society backed by nothing less than its holiest scriptures
>> The first part of the sentence is correct. But not the second part. Kindly provide proof (though I fear it is not aligned with the focus of this forum and hence may be a unnecessary detour).
Few things:
1) Varnas are not Castes as we know today.
2) The basis of a person belonging to a certain Varna = Vasana (intrinsic nature) that drives you to perform certain Deeds which impact the world around you (and self as well).
3) All 4 varnas are present in every being, it is what is dominant that gets branded.
4) Varnas are not birth specific. While it is true that one gets a "varna" handed over due to birth (because the Karmic balance has resulted in birth in a certain community that facilitates pursuit of goals associated with expunging the Vasana), the association of varna with birth is limited only to a certain time frame (if I remember right .. may be 7 years of age….till some maturity comes). After this point, the deeds of the person define his being and hence his Varna. So we have a Valmiki transcending Varnas, ditto with a Vyasa and many others.
On the other hand, Castes are a deviation from the Varna framework and not authorized by any scriptures. Castes are a result of the socio-economic-political benefits of promoting ones lineage over generations. Hence a priest with 10 acres of land would (out of love for his blood line) pass it over to his kids and make him a priest…so on and so forth.
Indic/ Hindu societies/ psyche have "Self-reform" capability built in. From time to time, you'd see many social reformers be they those who re-inforce Vedas or those who have a different view (Buddha, Jains). Even the saints/ babas etc have strived for Social reform: Annamayya, Shirdi Sai baba etc., Anecdotes of the likes of Adi Sankara being humbled by a Chandala are many. Point here is, often times "anti-caste/ anti-discrimination" has been the message of spiritual stalwarts as the real message scriptures as well.
Please do not consider a rule book written by some scholar as a divine authority on hindu society.
That said, I have no personal issue with any one who uses caste to "NOT" discriminate/ deny rights/ opportunities to others. So if a person from a community A, region B, economic class C is looking for a groom for his daughter from the categories, I'd see it more as a compatibility issue than a caste issue. I used the word "Community" here rather loosely. One is welcome to define one's community: Vysya, Catholic, Shia, indian parsi, Gond, Lambada etc.,
5) I have not seen any society/ civilisation in the world which did not have a 4 class framework. They may not have called it as "Varnas" – in the sense that they may not have defined and put a framework (you need Karmic theory for that which is not a part of Abrahamic faith….now I would not know if the other great civilisations had anything similar to Karmic theory….but common sense would say that for Varna as a theoretical framework to survive, one would need Karmic / previous birth's deeds theory to be in place first).
Now this 4 class framework that is there all over the world has always been "birth" based. In that sense it is "caste" framework. The only time it ever changed was when a powerful man/ woman broke the ranks and enforced their will on the society – a fact that's happened in all parts of the world (including India). So to summarize, the 4 class framework is actually a "caste" framework of all societies all over the world:
a) Priests / Scholars/ Educationists -typical religious / advisory class
b) Ruling class (includes warriors)
c) Merchant class
d) Worker class
Any society anywhere in the world at some time would have gone through some "nexus" between "a,b and c" (as they keep power and wealth generation after generation) and in the process keep "d" down. It is clear as the blue sky that typically the population split cannot have been more than 20-30% for a+b+c and about 70% for "d". Do you recollect who Jesus fought against? Who felt threatened by Jesus' preachings/ rising popularity – yes Sir : a + b + c.
So the discrimnation/ phenomena is not India specific though we have to be concerned more about India as it is "HOME".
I wanted to point out that :
a) it is misleading to say caste has divine ordinance in Hindu religion
b) to say that the discrimination is Hindu as it is as global as it can get.
Lastly, all the above has no direct relevance to the T-movement. But it does have some relevance because "anti-upper caste", "pro-lower caste" lobby has aligned itself with the movement with its own not-so-hidden agenda.
Achieving progress for all down trodden sections doesn't come from hatred. If an Ambani conjuers another project, then it is employment opportunity for 1000s. But if one plots to rob Ambani and redistribute wealth, the wealth will soon find a way to turn into dust.
Socialism is anti-nature; people are not born equal or end up being equal…they make their own fortunes through sheer ingenuity and hard work (and some help from the universe). Checks and balances should be in place so as to defeat discrimination or exploitation, but not to scuttle entreprenuerial spirit. I'm afraid the T-movement has woken up the Communist-Socialist giant which will take the State/ society back by at least 5 decades.
Hyderabai,
thanks for very good explanation.
English educated elite in India has fascination for finding fault with everything Indian.
Director Hrishikesh Mukharjee captured thier mood with witty comment in IMMORTAL 'ANAND'.
लिम्फो सार्कोमा आफ इम्टास्टाइन!
वाह बाबू मोशाय, क्या नाम हैं!
अगर किसी लड़की को हुवाना!
सम्जेगी अन्ग्रेजको गोद लिया है!
Just to add to your explaination,
There is a Professor of Economics by the name Ravi Batra (http://ravibatra.com/) who has written a book called The Downfall of Capitalism and Communism. The book, written in 1979, failed to get publicity until 1989 or so when the USSR failed. The author, in this book, professed that USSR will collapse and it happenned. According to him, capitalism will fail by 2020 (+ or – a decade).
What has that got to do with this debate? His logic for the failure of Communism and Capitalism is nothing to do with Economics but some thing to do with Varna system. According to his guru who proposed this theory, humans can be divided into 4 varnas (natures). Leaders, Intellectuals, Acquirers and Labourers. He goes onto explain that the power rotates among these 4 varnas and he explains why this happens.
>> Regionalism and castesim are two sides of the same coin ?
sorry… I didn’t mean it. But both have their own share of developing hatred on others in different contexts.
>> Caste was an institutionalized discrimination practised in hindu society backed by nothing less than its holiest scriptures.
) belongs to? who is vyasa maharshi? why is vidura neeti so popular? why did Lord Datta learned the dharma sutra from dharmavyagrudu, a lower caste butcher? which caste is bakta kannappa?
My goodness.. A theory of the production of late 19th or early 20th century anti hindu left wing pseudo intellectuals school of thought who didn’t read even a drop of what the hindu society is, but rejoices bashing everything it offers.. by the way, UN is not an holy command. coming to the point caste system or human division is prevailing or developed in different forms in different religions, u can name them sect, race, and what ever.. Coming to hinduism, caste system was never meant to discriminate but I agree it misused and ill practiced in the middle ages. if not, why we worship valmiki for giving us the holy book of ramayana? which caste does Lord Sri krishna (the ultimate justice
what u r talking abt dalits and tribals may be right but the bitter truth is ppl who call themselves oppressed, showing the same towards the others. , I saw ppl of BC caste showing the look down attitude on SCs and I saw while I was in college, the students of mala community showing the same behavior on a guy who is from erukula class.
apart from the above discussion, I do agree that religion and customs are always an evolution phenomenon and caste system is no exception. I dont even mind if it eliminates completely as it hardly is in use the way it has to be, we didn’t know how it would be if it eliminates. its a bit of curious to me.
>> All I was suggesting in my post is that the corrosive effects of casteism and the anger and rage it generates among its victims is being channelled in to this telangana nonsense
no.. I feel another misconceived approach for diagnosing the basic problem, corruption and crony capitalism and non-transparent governance. If you see the most of the allegations in T issue like lands, jobs etc.. they are all related to corruption which are projected as discrimination. we shoudn’t begin suspecting the caste for every damn problems we face
>> We cannot take a silly schoolboyish “out of topic” attitude ot social issues.
I would like to certainly discuss if u can come up with points (but not conclusions) how telangana issue and caste are interrelated or one channeled towards other. But I would certainly wouldn’t misuse the liberty given by the blog owner to discuss on all ‘social issues’ whether it can be caste system or communism vs democracy or gay and transgender rights.. I dont want to spoil the very purpose of the forum. I admit, though being a professional, still a school boy
I just want to add to my above post. I am linking the two issues of caste system and telangana but I am not linking the solutions to these issues. Its stupid to suggest that telangana should be tackled only after caste issue is addressed. And infact i see all indications that telangana movement is gone ..Dora Narasimha Reddy over enthusiastic activism is a more or less a final nail in the "movement". All I am saying is that I have not seen such interest in politics by educated "upper" caste people before telangana so it is a good oppurtunity to engage ourselves in the more difficult social issues telugu people are facing.
Let us not interject casteism into this episode. Solving casteism is not only the responsibility of telugu people but also that of entire India. Discussing this in the context of desecration of statues is very counter productive.
If Srikrishna Devaraya statue was brought down because of his upper caste, why not Rani Rudramadevi. If Nannaya statue was brought down because of anti brahmin anger, why not Bammera potana, who was born in niyogi brahmin family. If it was a dalit anger, why to bring down Gurram Jashuva of Guntur, who was a dalit himself. It was clearly done on regional lines. The escape of Alluri siutaramaraju, who some maoists try to emulate, could be the real clue who was behind this demolition and who is controlling the movement.
Kiran says: March 27, 2011 at 9:00 am
"It was a very polite and civilized thing to do knowing that I d'ont agree with you on many things"
We possibly agree on many or most things but did not discover these yet. In any case, we can (and should) engage with each other even if we disagree strongly in a spirit of positive discourse.
"Regionalism and castesim are two sides of the same coin"
Region, caste, state, language, country etc. are all dimensions of identity. Most people view issues through their "identity lens".
I do believe you have missed the significance of Jashuva (a pro-dalit poet though not a dalit himself) not being spared. Another significant inclusion is that of Srisri, the Naxalite icon.
Prabhakara Rao says: March 26, 2011 at 9:54 am
"I do not see any need for Samaikyavaadam embracing even social aspects"
Your choice, I guess you have weighed the pros & cons.
"second, this Samaikyavaadam is an ad-hoc gathering"
Yes and so is "seperatism". Different people are joining up for different reasons.
"I do not support any type of paintings on school walls".
I do not support religious or political symbols on any publicly funded initiative.
There must also be lacs of people who oppose these paintings for their own reasons (e.g. shirk)
Nalamotu uses the term "idols" in his blog heading. Interestingly enough, the commenters have chosen to call these out as "statues".
Prakaash gaaru,
I do not support religious or political symbols on any publicly funded initiative
This is triggering another "cake hunt".:-)
Yet I would like to say "this is where Indian democracy has failed".
Instead of designing a system out of existing frameworks, leaders of modern India chose to impose an alien system on the nation.
The alien system might have worked very well in its place of origin.
The "Localization" (Computer Software jargon) did not happen properly leaving too many holes in the Indian system.
I am sure you will find my response some gibberish. I will try to explain a bit
Why should we give up traditions that are thousands of years old?
Just becoz we embarced socialist democracy should we give up practices that (appear to be) are religious?
I have same question to you which I asked Kiran.
Why government recognizes thse practices, establishments, beliefs which are thought to be discriminatory? Why they were not abolished when constitution was framed?
BTW, by traditions I am not referring to a single religion, caste or system but ancient India, medivial India, Moderen India, Hindu India, Muslim India, Buddhist India, Moghul India, British India so on..
Naxalites dumped Srsisri long time ago. They don't adore him. Srisri is more like a communist leader, and there is no love last between naxlites and communists. Perhaps Srisri's communist leanings spared statue being dislodged.. Otherwise they would have dumped him in Hussain sagar too.
As far as Joshua, his father was yadava and his mother was madiga. At the minimum they would have given same consideration as Srisri but no chance as he was a dalit from Guntur.
The evidence is crystal clear the vocal support of separatism is coming from maosits and their sympathizers.
శ్రీశ్రీని మహాప్రస్థానానికి యజ్ఞోపవీతం ఉంది
— బండి నారాయణస్వామి (హెచ్ ఎం టీవీ దశ-దిశ మే 30, 2010)
KCR in 1996 opposed 6 Point formula and Zonal System…Changed his stance to take advantage
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=17ytWHdCYL8&feature=grec_index
I wonder why there is a statue for Brahma Naidu on Tankbund..Isn't he a factionist character in comic called palnati veera charithra ?
Intolerant scums fight each other over cock fights and false egos in the comic..
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